*Squeek*
Well, following my last post about the haul of Chaos Space Marines I recently laid my hands on, it was just today that I received an email from Games Workshop Japan announcing the new Chaos Space Marine Codex and models!
My initial reaction was a definite mix of excitement and disappointment.
Excitement - Look, Chaos Space Marines are just...cool. Great looking regular infantry (from the previous edition too), especially when adding in the recent Dark Vengeance models.
Check out these guys:
Chaos Marines:
Raptors:
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| Copyright Games Workshop |
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| Copyright Games Workshop |
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| Copyright Games Workshop |
Flying metallic dragons??
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| Copyright Games Workshop |
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| Copyright Games Workshop |
I could live with a version of an existing Space Marine flyer, because that would be in keeping with the current way that CSM vehicles are warped versions of SM vehicles. You know, the ones they probably would have had in the chapter vehicle pool when they "turned"...
No doubt there is a decent back story connection ("It came from the depths of Chaos") or something, but it just seems a bit too far out there for me.
Disappointment (2):
Armoured Dinosaurs???
Oops, wrong image. Here they are:
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| Forgefiend |
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| Maulerfiend |
Yeah, the "Forgefiend/ Maulerfiend".
So on the one hand there are REALLY nice models for certain units (Warp Talons) and on the other hand, plenty of "Meh" (at least for me). The Heldrake for example just doesn't seem "right". Now, I KNOW that this is a game set in the far future, so anything is possible, but somehow it doesn't work for me. I THINK the reason is that I was hoping for more military vehicles and that kind of tech, rather than this kind of stuff, (which I grant you is well posed and detailed!)
I think it might be worth "Chaosifying" (spikes, skulls, icons) the Forgeworld Storm Eagle instead of using the Heldrake...
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*Squeek*
Personally I think the new models are fantatic.
ReplyDeleteVery chaos. I get where you are coming from with them being a bit out there. But these dudes live in the warp....it doesnt care for normality!!! The poses, the way far out ideas for what they would do/look like...just soo. so...WIN.
I do think that a lot of the traitor chapters would have chaos'd up standard tech, but the legions (and the first chapters to turn many years ago) have had PLENTY of time for their techs to come up with suitably deamon and mental combos of steel and warp power.
Just because mankind shuns the need to invent new things, and instead sticks to STC's or varients there of, does not mean that chaos smiths would do the same. They are probably constantly thinking up new and exciting things to murder folks with.
As for using the storm talon and just chaosing it up, would you be wanting to use the rules for the Heldrake but with that model? As I really don't thnik that would work. They are FARRR To different in purpose and design. Going with a xeno flyer and converting that would look better. Perhaps Dark Eldar so that the spikes and razor shaped wings could be for the close combat of the sky thing?
Hi Angryhatter!
DeleteSo, I think you very reasonably represent the opposite opinion from my own! :-)
I think your logic is impeccable about Chaos and the warp - it does make sense from a fluff point of view. And hey they are Chaos Space Marines right?!
OTOH, I can't get away from thinking "Zoids!" everytime I see the flying dragons and dinos etc. (Not that Zoids aren't cool, just that they don't go well into 40K in my mind)
For the flyer rules, I would pretty much use the StormTalon rules (or whatever model I chaosed-up) not the Heldrake rules. This would broadly reflect the weapon and stats of the original Space Marine model (fitting my logic).
I haven't got the new rules yet, but maybe I could use allied flyers? (I also have a Tau army).
Thanks again for stopping by and the comment!
Squeek
Haha, I can see your point on Zoids!
DeleteThat would probably work best. You can chaos up almost anything and have it made some semblance of sense.
You could indeed use allied fliers. The allies chart allows for all sorts, so that is a very good option. Perhaps chaos them up, use the normal rules, but as the ally detachment!
You can use Guard and Tau fliers as allies of convenience if memory serves. So that is always a good option.
Plenty of choice really. Or you could convert your own Heldrake model, make it look more like what you would expect with the same rules?
Well, I think I would simply stay away from the Heldrake just because I don't like the aesthetics!
DeleteI guess that sounds kind of crazy, but I know from looking at it that I wouldn't get that "Yeah, awesome!" feeling as I got it out of my carry case for a game, no matter how big it is! (I get that feeling with pretty much every unit I have for my armies). The guys I play with are all friends in a small group, so there is a lot of scope for "counts as" kinds of games, so I might well go for "Chaosed-up" SM flyer unit with the same rules as the original SM model(after checking with the guys!)
Cheers,
Fair, although the rules for it may end up being too much if it is as good at flyer killing as the rumours suggest!!!
DeleteI can get that, its all down to personal preference in the end, if you don't like a model you wont want to include it. That's why I don't understand WAAC players, they win, but don't love their armies often.
That's the best way to go, just play with friends and you can pretty much do what ever provided its not too mental and unfair.
Sounds like you have a good plan TBH. Good stuff.
I am currently having to avoid starting an Iron Warriors force now that they have Cultists.
Need to finish the IG first, and prob the crons haha!
Angryhatter
Thanks for commenting on my blog!
ReplyDeleteI think the Maulerfiend and Forgefiend kit, while not looking great on their own, would actually look quite good as part of a Chaos Army painted up in the same way... but that remains to be seen.
The Heldrake, while an impressive enough model, lacks a certain amount of believability because it has no tail. I don't know too much about aerodynamics but I know things like birds and planes use their tails for balance; at present it looks more like a paper aeroplane. But it should be an impressive enough sight once it's on the table as part of an army.
That's my hope, anyway. I won't be buying anything for a while...
Thanks for the comment!
DeleteI agree that they will probably look pretty impressive when painted-up and on the battlefield, but (as odd as this sounds considering this is a game set in a totally fictional universe) like you I have a problem with the "believability". I guess the normal rules of the universe don't apply to Chaos though!
:-)
Like you, I will probably not get this for a while, if at all.
yeah i had the same reaction to the bird-dragon-jet thing and the armored-robot-tentacle-minigun-saurs. yeah anything can come out of the pits of chaos, but they're just... they don't quite fit. chaos have alwasy been warped versions of regular SM with the addition of daemons for the otherworldly part, but those two models in particular don't really fit with either and it's a little odd. they look like digimon...
ReplyDeleteLets face it though. If they called it 'armored-robot-tentacle-minigun-saurs' it would be a must buy!!!
DeleteThe bird idea would be better with a large raven or something IMO. Least for a Nurgle army.
They may have always been warped marines, but they have also always been traitor chapters for the most part. This is much for legiony. Which IMO makes this path make MUCH more sense.
"ZOIDS-armoured-robot-tentacle-minigun-saurs" really would be a MUST buy.
DeleteSeriously though, I am more of a fan of the "Traitor" legion route over the warp/ Chaos route, so that is how I will probably play the army.
As mentioned elsewhere, if I really have to have flyers then ultimately I will probably get a Vanilla SM flyer and change it so it looks suitable.